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100 mg Sprycel is not necessary for first line treatment

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/cncr.31357

Early Results of Lower Dose Dasatinib (50 mg Daily) as
Frontline Therapy for Newly Diagnosed Chronic-Phase
Chronic Myeloid Leukemia

 

I have known for a long time that 100 mg Dasatinib (Sprycel) is overly toxic and can lead to pleural effusions as well as blood suppression.

What the authors report is that 50 mg is as effective and should be considered as the new standard of care (i.e. start with 50 - go up only if you have to).

I am thankful that Dr. Cortes never prescribed 100 mg to me in 2011. He knew then what was published just now. Dr. Cortes is one of the authors on this paper.

I am so very grateful for your advice on this Scuba.

My husband was able to reduce his dosage from 100 to 50 after 6 months because we pushed his oncologist and showed him the relevant research. I wouldn't have thought to even suggest this route without your input.

Still early days but so far so good for him. He feels so much better physically and mentally on 50. A huge deal for our family.

best, Louise

Thanks for the link...which I have put on our Article resource pages.

Sandy

Below is an editorial by Dr. Schiffer

discussing the results that 50mg Dasatinib should be the starting dose for first line treatment:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/cncr.31516

The Evolution of Dasatinib Dosage Over the Years and Its
Relevance to Other Anticancer Medications

It is powerful testimony that clinical trial outcomes are not perfect and that one size does not fit all. It is sad that so many doctors who are not researchers have no choice but to prescribe the full 100mg dose (and continue to do so) despite so much evidence that this could be hurting their patients. Fortunately, we learn and over time new protocols become established.

from the editorial linked above:

"these observations reinforce the desirabil-
ity of better defining the lowest effective dose, particularly
for drugs that are intended to be given for many years and
perhaps for life."

This forum, in so many ways, is at the forefront of research. All of us are like reporters following every trail of new data and knowledge that gets reported here before it is even published (in many cases years later). I knew that 100mg Dasatinib was a problem back in 2011. My doctor, (Cortes) said as much and never started me on the 100 mg dose. He dropped me to 20 mg and suggested it could likely work and spare me the side effects. I reported my experience to others (US forum), but some were afraid to try it because their doctor refused - saying things like it will cause "resistance" as if cancer is a bacteria and that clinical trials establishing the 100 mg dose are perfectly done. There is no "perfect" in science. There is only hypothesis testing and continual learning and refining. I am PCRU on 20 mg. Dasatinib. Imagine how many more patients would be likely to get the same outcome as me (although I do take vitamin D, curcumin, fasting, etc. which may be augmenting Dasatinib's lower dose effectiveness - we don't know, but I tried to stack the deck in my favor).

Benefits from nutrition - vitamin D, curcumin, fasting - all of these ideas are from anecdotal evidence and some scientific testing which moves us closer to better treatment. The data for these ideas are "us" - we are test subjects in our own personal trials to learn and apply. No pharmaceutical company would spend the money to 'clinically' trial in a true scientifically valid way what we have learned anecdotally. We could be wrong with little risk - but more importantly, what if we are right.

My advice to our fellow CML patients is to treat your doctor as one point of many points of information. To be willing to apply additional therapy especially when that therapy has no risk (i.e. dose modification, vitamin supplement, etc.). And most importantly to challenge your doctor with new data you discover and ask "why" not.

 

 

Thank you so much for this article. You have stated for a long time that 100mg might not be necessary for everyone.

In the article, 50mg does even better than 100mg so far. A possible explanation is that 50mg would create a lower immuno-suppression than 100mg and that the immune system would fight along Dasatinib against leukemic cells?

The article also mentioned a new planned trial with 50mg Dasatinib and bcl2 inhibitor (venetoclax).

 

Yes, you are right and I agree with all your points about the rich mine of data that is collected on fora like ours. RE: dose reduction, some years ago a fellow advocate decided to reduce her dasatinib dose to 20mg - after a lot of research, she finally convinced her doctor to monitor her very closely while she tried this not insignificant dose reduction. The update is that she has maintained her DMR for many years (possibly 5 or 6) at this very low dose. 

I don't mean to be a tease, but there are some very interesting data about to be published... embargoed until end of May, but I will share as soon as I possibly can.

Sandy

Sandy - what a tease! What kind of data is embargoed?

Oral presentation of interesting 3-year data from UK DESTINY trial. EHA publishes on, or just before, the upcoming Annual Congress - 14th - 17th June in Stockholm, Sweden.

Sandy 

I am resident in the UK.  I see my doctor on 23 May for my 6 month BCR results.  Would she be party to the embargo'd data at that date or is it not worth discussing until my 9 month BCR appointment?

Libby we shared the following article with my husband’s oncologist , which persuaded him to half his dosage at 6 months . At that time his bar- bcr was at 0.15 . We pushed to lower because of side effects which we could see were building month by month. He also seems to be having a little bit of mylosuppression ( platelets dropping) so glad he is on 50. 

http://ascopubs.org/doi/abs/10.1200/JCO.2017.35.15_suppl.e18551

Hi Libby, 

First of all, your doctor is likely not privy to that data. And even if they were, it would be inconsequential for someone 6 months from diagnosis.

There is so much research going on with CML at the moment, with lots of trials about dose reduction, stopping TKIs, taking TKIs in combination with other drugs etc... so do not worry, you are not missing out on anything right now.

David.

Hi Suba,

How do we access this article to read and show to our doctors? It doesn’t have a register as new user that I could find on the site so that the article can be accessed.

I am on 50 mgm Sprycel for the past year and continue to be PCRU.

My physician is a believer in the resistant theory and won’t go to a lower dose.

Anything to help educate that I can share with him would be great. I thought this article might be a good beginning.

I am new here and I take 100mg of sprycel since 2014, happy to know that it is possible to reduce the dose to 50mg. I asked my doctor to reduce it, but he insists that there are no studies and that the minimum is 100mg. so much that I tried to know about it here in portugal and found this forum, where for the first time I speak with people with CML. I feel very very tired and think it is because of taking this 100mg. in 2012 I started with ematinib and it was horrible and finally in 2015 with sprycel happened RMM with 0.0121. I currently have 0.0049. Very happy and thankful

Hi Kali,

When this article was first posted it was available for a PDF download, which I did. I have the 8 page PDF article and can email it to you.

Maybe you could private message me on the LLS site and then I can email it to you.

 

Kirk

Thanks for link.

I am 4 years on Sprycel with 100, then 70 and now 50 with great results.

It would be nice to go to 20 and stay there until we learn more success with discontinuing completely.

Thanks Kirk, I will go over to read your post.

For anyone who wants to read a copy of this paper, head to http://www.sci-hub.tw and put the DOI link below into the search box. 

https://doi.org/10.1002/cncr.31357

 

The paper should then load. 

David, thanks for this link so we can access the original article. yes