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Virus' do not like the sun ....

 

https://www.the-star.co.ke/opinion/columnists/2020-02-24-vitamin-d-vital...

Vitamin D vital to keeping away disease

We all have been hearing about 'coronavirus' and the pandemic they claim could be happening around the planet. But truth be told, it is less virulent than the flu and affects those who have compromised immune systems. 80% of infected people have minor symptoms. The other 20% get "sick", stay in bed and recover. A tiny fraction of those, develop severe lung issues from pneumonia. And a few percent of those have died because of lung failure.

Around 80,000 people died from flu last year. Coronavirus has killed 2500 over that same time period. What a shame this has been hyped so much. Could you get sick from Coronavirus - sure. Will you die from it. Not likely. Keep it in perspective.

Also.

In other words, people who live indoors, shun the sun and have low vitamin D.

Most virus' don't do well in summer time - ask yourself, "why is that?". Why no flu in summer?

Make sure your vitamin D level is above 50 ng/ml, and ideally around 70 ng/ml and coronavirus will simply not have a chance. (And CML will have a fighting time too).

People are terrified Scuba... I do not know what to believe...If you watch news on TV you will understand the reason that people are so scared...

People are terrified Scuba... I do not know what to believe...If you watch news on TV you will understand the reason that people are so scared...

The 'media' is doing a great job of scaring people. All so unnecessary.

https://www.vox.com/recode/2020/1/31/21115589/coronavirus-wuhan-china-my...

https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/479581-how-worried-should-we-be-a...

https://newsradio1310.com/despite-media-hype-coronavirus-isnt-the-black-...

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/18/opinion/coronavirus-china-numbers.html

Infections

COVID-19: Approximately 79,553 cases worldwide; 35 cases in the U.S. as of Feb. 24, 2020.

Flu: Estimated 1 billion cases worldwide; 9.3 million to 45 million cases in the U.S. per year.
Deaths

COVID-19: Approximately 2,628 deaths reported worldwide; 0 deaths in the U.S., as of Feb. 24, 2020.

Flu: 291,000 to 646,000 deaths worldwide; 12,000 to 61,000 deaths in the U.S. per year.

 

The British Daily Mail cites a government report which estimates a worst-case of 80% of the United Kingdom population being infected and 500,000 people dying. The Financial Times All Share Index is down about 5% in the month, so clearly markets are more rational than the Daily Mail's government source.

There is a middle ground here.  No, not many people have died, but then the virus is not widespread and we don't have a vaccine.  We should not be panicking and locking ourselves in our houses, but governments and health systems need to be making plans.  A lot is unknown.  Most folks only get a mild case, but a fair number get truly sick, and they think asymptomatic people are infectious.  I'm certainly taking it seriously but there is a big difference between keeping an eye on the situation and taking it seriously and complete panic.  A lot is still unknown.  My being chair of the Board of Health in our town no doubt makes a difference in my perspective.  I suppose if I were not I'd not be paying as close attention yet.

In the UK about 8000 people die each year from secondary conditions as a result of contracting flu and as Scuba suggests these are usually those with weak immune systems and those with very poor health-there must be a figures for flu related deaths in USA and other countries.

If you really want to see some scary history look at "Spanish flu" 1918-19 on Wikipedia or if in UK you may still be able to access the BBC2 recent programme on the Spanish flu via i player;one theory is that it originated in Kansas via wild water fowl and was then transmitted via troop movements into Europe and worldwide.Australia was safe because it locked out  all ships and sea borne vessels .Otherwise look at the film "Contagion".

In the Spanish flu pandemic the virus was quite clever as it reinvented and strengthened itself and waged war most of all with those with the strongest immune systems -the healthiest mid age patients.

As CML patients I agree with Scuba re the need to ensure good diet and vitamin sufficiency supported by adequate exercise-have a look at the book "Lifestyle after Cancer" by "oncologist of the year" Professor Robert Thomas-it talks very good medical based sense and good practice to patients such as ourselves who may be  more at risk from infections resulting from immune suppression.

Regards

John

Some observations:

https://time.com/5610878/2018-2019-flu-season/

https://www.livescience.com/new-coronavirus-compare-with-flu.html

1. Coronavirus is a virus that affects the lungs - similarly to the flu.

2. Coronavirus is a virus - which our bodies can defend against naturally and develop natural immunity after exposure.

3. Over 80% of coronavirus sufferers have a mild case and many don't even know they had it - (which is why it can spread so easily).

This is important - the reason coronavirus is popping up around the world is that most, not "some", but most who get it, don't even know they have it - so they get on planes, get in trains, and travel and spread it all over the place. In Wuhan, China, it was concentrated and already cases are dropping.

4. 20% of the remaining infected people get "sick". Just like the flu or a bad cold. They stay home, drink tea and recover. They know they are sick and don't spread the disease because THEY ARE SICK. These are not the people who are spreading the disease (much).

5. The remaining people who are very sick succumb to a secondary bacterial infection - pneumonia. That is what kills them. You don't hear in the news about healthy people getting coronavirus and dying - like Ebola. Ebola is truly scary - your body disintegrates. It didn't spread much because you die before you get to spread it. Not so with coronavirus.

6. Like the flu, coronavirus erupted during winter time. Ask yourself, what happens in winter that makes flu a winter season sickness? You never hear about flu in summer - why?

Now for my High horse:

1. Flu season is lasting longer and longer (see article above) - why? Could it be that "we" smart people in the 21st century thinking we know everything and can do better than nature with our sunscreen invention and brilliant notion to avoid the sun, which by the way, has been in the sky for a few billion years and always, every single day, when mankind was formed - we are told, the sun is dangerous - cover up with sunscreen and avoid the sun.

No wonder virus' are having a renaissance!

2. Wuhan China is a large city whose people are not out in the sun with little clothing especially in winter (it's very cold in winter in Wuhan and summer s tend to be cloudier).

3. Vitamin D is synthesized in the skin by sun activation. What a brilliant invention by nature. Vitamin D has a half life of 60 days - fat soluble and takes a long time to build up (i.e. summer) and a long time to drain down (i.e. winter). It's natures way to allow vitamin D to be available to the body during times when the sun is not strong (i.e. winter) and to build up gradually during summer peak time. Imagine that.

4. Winter is a time when people who don't know, and have already hidden from the sun during the summer, have very low vitamin D levels.

5. When a virus hits their bodies, they have little defense to stop it. Their T-cells are not getting activated (required vitamin D) in sufficient quantity to attack the new virus. They get sick.

And

from the Guardian, "Currently, out of 81,000 confirmed Covid-19 cases worldwide, which have caused more than 2,700 deaths, just 22 have been identified in Australia, with zero deaths."

What is so special about Australia that so little has occurred there? Could it be they are in SUMMER?

What you can do:

1. Beginning now (since we are coming into March - northern latitude - get some sun. The sun is already 200 watts per square inch stronger than in December. Slow exposure to increasing sun amount will condition your skin to get back in business and make vitamin D.

2. Supplement. I take 5,000 IU's per day vitamin D3 in summer - IN SUMMER, and 15,000 IU's over two days in winter.

3. Test your vitamin D level and make sure it is above 50 ng/ml. Most people will test in the 20's or lower. When I was diagnosed with CML, my vitamin D level was 17 ng/ml. Now, I keep it around 70 ng/ml

4. Be prudent around people who sneeze. Don't touch your eyes without having first washed your hands with soap.

And if you get sick, drink some tea.

 

Scuba,

I share your perspective on Vit D3 (with K2) as well as keeping an optimal dietary daily intake of essential VITs and minerals as possible. I would also add- and this is from personal experience having had an SCT in 2003 - that high dose Vitamin C (ascorbic acid) on a daily basis is essential in supporting the immune system - especially if dealing with a viral infection, be that Flu or the common cold.

The following article published by OrthomolecularMedicine.org has some sound advice on Vit C supplementation.

My personal experience is this. Since diagnosis, I have always taken high daily doses of Vitamin C of 1/2 -1 tsp (2.5 to 5 grammes) of Ascorbic Acid powder in large glass of water (or juice) up to 5 or more times a day spending on need.

Over the years, this, along with the usual bed rest etc. has helped me deal with quite a few bouts of Flu and chest infections. However, since adding an average of 12,000 iu of Vit D3/K2 to my daily regime, in the last 2 years I have not had Flu or a chest infection serious enough to keep me off work.       This is in spite of working, according to my haematologist, in the front line for exposure to all kinds of bacterial and viral infections i.e the retail sector with entails handling cash/payment cards etc directly from the public.

I absolutely agree that people should find out what their current Vit D3 level is and if under 60ng ml (very likely for those living in Northern Hemisphere) should supplement with D3 w/K2 as you have consistency advised for some time now.

For those who are interested in learning more about Ascorbic Acid and how it can be beneficial for health, I recommend the following book by Drs. Steve Hickey PhD and Hilary Roberts Phd,  'Ascorbate' The Science of Vitamin C.

I hope the following article is helpful to those who are interested in nutritional medicine,

Sandy

 

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Orthomolecular Medicine News Service, Feb 28, 2020

Vitamin C and COVID-19 Coronavirus

by Damien Downing, MBBS, MRSB and Gert Schuitemaker, PhD

(OMNS February 28, 2020) There is only one existing treatment for the new coronavirus: vitamin C.

*Vitamin C supports your immune system.
*Vitamin C helps to kill the virus and reduces the symptoms of infection.
*It's not a COVID "cure," but nothing is.
*It might just save your life, though, and will definitely reduce the severity of the infection.

If someone tells you it's not proven, consider two things:

*Nothing is proven to work against COVID-19, because it is a new virus.
*Vitamin C has worked against every single virus including influenzas, pneumonia, and even poliomyelitis.

What to do

If you do nothing else, start taking vitamin C right away; at least 3 grams a day, spread right across the day. That's a 1,000 milligram capsule every 8 hours, or a level teaspoon of powder dissolved in a pint or so of water, drank all through the day.

If you're smart and motivated, do all the other things recommended in our previous release Vitamin C Protects Against Coronavirus http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n04.shtml

When and if you catch a bug that might be COVID-19, simply increase your vitamin C intake: a rounded teaspoon (that's 4 to 5 grams) in water (which helps to keep you hydrated) every 3 or 4 hours. And keep on taking it.

Do you consult a doctor? Do you self-isolate? Yes and yes. Of course you do; that's your duty to others.

Vitamin C and the other measures are what you do for yourself.

These links provide a large number of references to back up our above statements:

Feb 21, 2020 Three Intravenous Vitamin C Research Studies Approved for Treating COVID-19 http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n12.shtml

Feb 16, 2020 Early Large Dose Intravenous Vitamin C is the Treatment of Choice for 2019-nCov Pneumonia,    http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n11.shtml

Feb 13, 2020 Coronavirus Patients in China to be Treated with High-Dose Vitamin C, http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n10.shtml

Feb 10, 2020 VITAMIN C AND ITS APPLICATION TO THE TREATMENT OF nCoV CORONAVIRUS: How Vitamin C Reduces Severity and Deaths from Serious Viral Respiratory Diseases, http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n09.shtml

Feb 2, 2020 Hospital-based Intravenous Vitamin C Treatment for Coronavirus and Related Illnesses, http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n07.shtml

Jan 30, 2020 Nutritional Treatment of Coronavirus, http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n06.shtml

Jan 26, 2020 Vitamin C Protects Against Coronavirus, http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n04.shtml

SIGNED:
Ilyès Baghli, M.D. (Algeria)
Ian Brighthope, M.D. (Australia)
Helen Saul Case, M.S. (USA)
Richard Cheng, M.D., Ph.D. (USA)
Gilbert Henri Crussol, D.M.D. (Spain)
Carolyn Dean, M.D., N.D. (USA)
Damien Downing, MBBS, MRSB (United Kingdom)
Michael Ellis, M.D. (Australia)
Martin P. Gallagher, M.D., D.C. (USA)
Michael J. Gonzalez, N.M.D., D.Sc., Ph.D. (Puerto Rico)
William B. Grant, Ph.D. (USA)
Tonya S. Heyman, M.D. (USA)
Suzanne Humphries, M.D. (USA)
Ron Hunninghake, M.D. (USA)
Robert E. Jenkins, D.C. (USA)
Bo H. Jonsson, M.D., Ph.D. (Sweden)
Jeffrey J. Kotulski, D.O. (USA)
Peter H. Lauda, M.D. (Austria)
Thomas Levy, M.D., J.D. (USA)
Homer Lim, M.D. (Philippines)
Stuart Lindsey, Pharm.D. (USA) Victor A. Marcial-Vega, M.D. (Puerto Rico)
Charles C. Mary, Jr., M.D. (USA)
Mignonne Mary, M.D. (USA)
Jun Matsuyama, M.D., Ph.D. (Japan)
Jorge R. Miranda-Massari, Pharm.D. (Puerto Rico)
Karin Munsterhjelm-Ahumada, M.D. (Finland)
Tahar Naili, M.D. (Algeria)
W. Todd Penberthy, Ph.D. (USA)
Dag Viljen Poleszynski, Ph.D. (Norway)
Datuk Selvam Rengasamy, MBBS (Malaysia)
Jeffrey A. Ruterbusch, D.O. (USA)
Andrew W. Saul Ph.D. (USA)
Gert E. Schuitemaker, Ph.D. (Netherlands)
Robert G. Smith, Ph.D. (USA)
Thomas L. Taxman, M.D. (USA)
Jagan Nathan Vamanan, M.D. (India)
Garry Vickar, MD (USA)
Ken Walker, M.D. (Canada)
Atsuo Yanagisawa, M.D., Ph.D. (Japan)
Anne Zauderer, D.C. (USA)

Nutritional Medicine is Orthomolecular Medicine

Orthomolecular medicine uses safe, effective nutritional therapy to fight illness. For more information: http://www.orthomolecular.org

Find a Doctor

To locate an orthomolecular physician near you: http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v06n09.shtml

The peer-reviewed Orthomolecular Medicine News Service is a non-profit and non-commercial informational resource.

Andrew W. Saul, Ph.D. (USA), Editor-In-Chief
Editor, Japanese Edition: Atsuo Yanagisawa, M.D., Ph.D. (Japan)
Editor, Chinese Edition: Richard Cheng, M.D., Ph.D. (USA)
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Sandy,

It was good to read your experience with vitamin D/K2 for prevention of virus infection. The more I read on the subject, the more clear it is that normal community spread of virus (especially of the corona type) is largely stopped in its tracks in people with adequate vitamin D. It is why, when you are surrounded by people hacking and coughing on a crowded subway, many do not get sick. Think about this - on any given day in the 'tube', in winter, there are dozens and dozens of people around you coming down with something and are not sick enough yet to stay home, and are surely passing around their virus' to all around them. Yet, most people don't get sick. And I bet, the ones who do, have low vitamin D - even if they have antibodies to the virus from a previous exposure.

What makes coronavirus out of China a problem is that it is new. Antibodies have to be built up in the population. Those with excellent vitamin D stores, build up antibodies very fast - fast enough that they don't even have symptoms. The very fact that Coronavirus becomes symptomatic slowly (i.e. community spread is easy because people are contagious, but not sick), highlights how weak a virus this is.

If only people were taught about adequate vitamin D, especially in China, Wuhan province would have been spared. This coronavirus nonsense will be gone by April. You read it here first. What a new Internet age we live in where "fear" and "mis-information" can fly around the globe in a minute causing needless emotional and financial panic. I don't go around wearing a mask. Masks don't even work. How foolish. It's hand to face that spreads the disease.

Vitamin C:

I learned most of vitamin C greater than 500 mg ingested at one time is eliminated by the body. It is a waste to take more than 500 mg at once. The body can only use 500 mg at one time - any more is rapidly excreted. As a result, I only take vitamin C in 500 mg capsules one - two times per day - sometimes three times if I am around "sick" people - but then, that is what vitamin D is for ...

https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/VitaminC-HealthProfessional/

from the article linked above,

"Oral vitamin C produces tissue and plasma concentrations that the body tightly controls. Approximately 70%–90% of vitamin C is absorbed at moderate intakes of 30–180 mg/day. However, at doses above 1 g/day, absorption falls to less than 50% and absorbed, unmetabolized ascorbic acid is excreted in the urine [4]. Results from pharmacokinetic studies indicate that oral doses of 1.25 g/day ascorbic acid produce mean peak plasma vitamin C concentrations of 135 micromol/L, which are about two times higher than those produced by consuming 200–300 mg/day ascorbic acid from vitamin C-rich foods [10]. Pharmacokinetic modeling predicts that even doses as high as 3 g ascorbic acid taken every 4 hours would produce peak plasma concentrations of only 220 micromol/L [10].

The total body content of vitamin C ranges from 300 mg (at near scurvy) to about 2 g [4]. High levels of vitamin C (millimolar concentrations) are maintained in cells and tissues, and are highest in leukocytes (white blood cells), eyes, adrenal glands, pituitary gland, and brain. Relatively low levels of vitamin C (micromolar concentrations) are found in extracellular fluids, such as plasma, red blood cells, and saliva [4]."

The above science was compelling to me. The body simply won't let you shove more vitamin C into the blood than it can use at one time. It's sort of a rate limiting thing. Pushing more in doesn't change the concentration in the blood much - kidneys simply get rid of it and cause kidney issues:

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/side-effects-of-too-much-vitamin-c#...

So I adopted (which you correctly pointed out in your post) an approach of maximizing my blood vitamin C level by ingesting only that much vitamin C, the body can use at a time - which by itself is much much higher than the current RDA of 30 mg.

Hi Scuba,

yes I am very familiar with the argument about the 'body' only absorbing as much Vit C as it can take make us of at any one time... but, we have individual tolerances/needs so, I might need/tolerate more than you, or vice versa.

The test I have always used is the 'gastro test', by which I mean when I think I might be developing Flu/cold/infection I immediately up my dose of C. Then when my body has absorbed as much as it needs, or can tolerate, I will inevitably experience a bout of diarrhoea. From what I have read and found to be true for me this effect is desirable and a signal that your tissues are indeed saturated, so that is the point when I reduce in the amount I am taking. This is anecdotal of course but I have had a lot of 'experiments' with high dose Vit C over many years and found it really works for me when dealing with viral infections etc.

Even when I am well, I continue to take much more than 500mg daily - more like 3 grammes daily-  without experiencing any dire consequences. I have never had kidney issues since I started taking regular high dose C over 20 years ago now.

The book I mentioned in my post above is just one of many on this subject and gives credence to my own experience with high dose C. As I said, this is my personal experience, but I have found it works well for me.

Sandy 

 

 

Hi Scuba, I read that one can get infected with the corona virus, heal completely, then catch it again!

Bad news, as apparently there is no long lasting immunity. If people can catch it multiple times, it looks like this poxy virus tends to mutate...a well known trick in many viruses' arsenal.

pigeon.

I don't believe that's the case ... if someone catches it again, it's a relapse, they never developed a full immunity. I relapsed with flu back in the day, but once I improved my vitamin D profile, - never again have I had the flu - or cold or sniffles for that matter. I suspect coronavirus mutates similarly to flu in its periodicity. And right now, flu is much more deadly than coronavirus.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/be-careful-where-you-get-your-news-a...

I will wager that by mid-April, May 1st latest, this virus is gone. Remind me at that time if I was correct. The sun will do its job in the northern hemisphere for both virus' (corona & influenza) by raising peoples vitamin D levels. And this virus' is susceptible to an immune response (which is good news!).

(*I often wonder if vitamin D is such a simple solution (and vitamin C as well as per Sandy), why have we not heard more about it. Very simple - no clinical trials using an over the counter vitamin. This is partly why we have to be vigilant about our own personal healthcare. I know from experience that once I raised my vitamin D level to around 70 ng/ml - I have not been sick with flu, colds or anything respiratory in years.)

 

Hi Scuba, thanks for your reply, I would very much like to share your bet that in 2 or 3 months this virus will be a goner. Me being an optimist, I subscribe to your prediction. I have never taken the flu jab and thank God, have never caught the flu.

Have you taken the yearly flu vaccination?

My vit D level is borderline, only 75nmol/L, about half of your great level of 70ng/ml.

Don't get me wrong now, I do see the wisdom of upping the vit D level, but my concern is the danger of hypercalcemia, as I am not sure how often I have to have a blood test to monitor my vit D level, to stay on track, and not become hypercalcemic.

So I therefore err on the side of caution and take D3 1000IU daily.

pigeon.

I have never had a flu shot. And given what I have learned, no need to. In the best case, flu shots are only 50% effective against the flu strain for which it is targeted - and if the wrong strain is out and about (like this year), then flu shots are useless. Think about that - only 50% effective. Why? Stimulating the immune system to create antibodies 'ahead' of a flu season makes sense if the immune system is ready to go. Lack of vitamin D leads to an immune system that is not activated. So when you get your flu shot and get exposed to a live virus, your body doesn't activate T-cells in sufficient numbers which have been primed by the vaccine. In other words, people with very low vitamin D (~ 20 ng/ml) probably are the ones getting sick anyway even if they had a flu shot - as the statistics show.

Regarding hypercalcemia:

This is why it is important to take vitamin K2 WITH vitamin D. Hypercalcemia is not likely if you have adequate blood level of K2. This is because K2 is necessary to activate enzymes which bind to excess calcium and move it to bone.

https://www.nutraceuticalbusinessreview.com/news/article_page/Vitamin_K2...

You are correct that vitamin D "pumps" calcium from food into the blood. And that can cause hypercalcemia if the calcium has no where to go. This is where K2 comes in ... K2 sops it up and sends it to bone. In the bone, vitamin D is used again to make the deposit. Without K2 - Vitamin D pumps up calcium (hypercalcemia) and then vitamin D sits and waits in the bone and no calcium shows up (I'm being dramatic for effect). With lots of K2 around, it is near impossible to become hypercalcemic even with daily doses of 10,000 IU's per day vitamin D(3) (upper limit). My blood calcium is rock-solid normal - and when I had a coronary artery scan last year, I have the arteries of 20 year old. In 2013, my arteries were 70% calcified! That's how powerful K2 is in cleaning up excess calcium.

Read up on vitamin D and K2 together. There is a lot of high quality information which will guide you. Avoid the "marketing" articles - read the science. It is compelling.

 

Yes Scuba, we totally agree about the flu jab. The reasons you mentioned for declining it, are precisely the reasons for which I keep declining it.

Hypercalcemia:

I only turn to high quality articles, as long as they are not strictly for the medical profession, being only a little housewife, not a scientist, I would not pretend to fully understand scientific papers. Reading those articles taught me about adjuvants, such as aluminum adjuvants, for example,  their long standing safety record but also..... their potential to contribute to immunological disorders:  help! even articles published by the NCBI are sometimes slightly conflicting.

Other then the D vitamin, I take no supplements except 4 lovely Brazils per day. I still remember the shock I got years ago, when I read that you should NOT have more then about 4 a day; silly me used to eat them like they were peanuts. I love the whole thing about Brazil trees, them being truly wild trees.

Thank you for your advice regarding vit K. I certainly get lots of it in my diet, but I shall have to start delving into it in more details, before I decide to ramp up my vit D intake.

It's going to take some time, but then lets face it, knowledge gained in a day is probably not worth much anyway. I shall start with the article in your link.

pigeon

Pigeon - vitamin K2 is NOT the same as vitamin K  ( the kind you get from leafy green veggies).

Vitamin K2 is very different in its function and is mostly available from fermented foods such as Natto, Kimchi and hard cheeses (Gouda). I take 200 mcg per day AND I eat Japanese Natto (~350 mcg in a serving).

Hi Scuba,

my Vit D results were 16 ! The doctor says vit D 800iu daily is enough to increase it, what do you think ?

 

NO. 800 IU - is your doctor kidding!

You are at Rickets level....very low.

When I first tested, I was also at 16 ng/ml. My doctor prescribed 50,000 IU's per week for 3 weeks to raise it - just to get me to the so-called normal range (~ 30). After reading, learning and "thinking", I did the following:

10,000 IU's per day every day per week for three weeks of over the counter vitamin D3. Then I tested again and my vitamin D rose to 29. Still horribly low. I then continued to take 5,000 one day and 10,000 the next throughout the winter. This raised my vitamin D to around 60. I continued that program until Summer when my blood level finally achieved around 70 - 80 ng/ml. I then reduced to 5,000 per day for the summer skipping days when I was out in the sun with no clothes on....well a few clothes. Only when I was exposed to the sun did I not take vitamin D3 that day. Even with this much vitamin D3, my blood level would fall to around 44 to a high of 90. Just depends on what the body wants. I tend to test twice a year. Mid March and mid September.

Very important. Consider taking vitamin K2 (I take 200 mcg) along with D3. They work together in managing calcium in the blood and body. I would avoid taking more than 10,000 IU's of vitamin D3 on any given day.

Hi Scuba,

thanks so much for the swift reply, I thought as much having read your info on Vit D so I asked my oncologist aswell as Gp and they both said 800 iu daily was sufficient!! 

I’ll increase my dose tomorrow, it may also help with my low mood.

Thanks again, you are a great source of information. This forum is invaluable.

Well, just shows you what I know about vitamin K, obviously not a lot. And I thought I was winning eating lots of greenies.

Regarding that nutraceutical link, lots of info there, and being slow I shall have to read it again; It was nice to see that it also raises a warning regarding the use of statins.  Luckily healthy eating practices take care of the cholesterol balance, so I have no worries there.

Another small consolation was to read elsewhere that our gut bacteria also produce small amounts of the elusive K2. (I know I know, it's not enough....)

pigeon

 

Hi All

I am also having problems with my Vit D levels. After taking D3 supplement prescribed by my GP my latest Vit D test showed I was now "adequate" at 36 !! I was very low before so goodness only knows what the reading was. My GP has now raised my Vit D3 from 800 to 1000 and I shall see if it's made any difference when I have the next lot of bloods taken. My haem is good and includes a request for the Vit D test these days after I asked. I wonder if the level was so low as, on imatinib for the past 10 yrs I have been totally unable to sit in any sun without blistering - (even under a beach umbrella in long sleeves) - until this last year.

best

Chrissie

I did an informal, very non-scientific survey on the US forum asking CML patients what their vitamin D level was at diagnosis. Many did not know, but those who did reported it was very low - around 10 - 20 ng/ml. There was not a single response where someone reported that they had high vitamin D > 60 ng/ml and developed CML. Not one.

This is anecdotal to me. I strongly believe people who maintain high normal vitamin D levels during their younger years into middle age - are likely to avoid CML (and probably other cancers as well). Pure conjecture on my part - based on a casual non-scientific observation. We know vitamin D is necessary to activate the immune system, particularly T-cells. These are the same cells involved in cancer surveillance.

Regarding dose ... When out in the summer sun for a days activities (e.g. at the beach, a park), our skin will produce around 10,000 IU's of vitamin D. That fact is why it is safe to take upwards of 10,000 IU's in winter when sun power is very low (especially in places like Norway, where the data was collected). https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25053469

The reason daily recommendation for vitamin D is so low is because the recommendation is based on Rickets - the disease you get from too low vitamin D. 800 IU's is sufficient to prevent Rickets. But for immune health! - we need much more. And nature gives it to us when we don't wear sunscreen and get exposure in the summer - a lot more. And nature has built in storage so that we accumulate vitamin D during summer and have plenty during the winter months to carry us through. Unfortunately (or not), we don't live and work outdoors like our ancestors, so during summer we live in computer caves - and were taught to avoid the sun! No wonder cancer spiked during the 20th century.

 

 

 

That was some survey you did Scuba, and although as you say "non scientific", it certainly tells a tale, and the results are not to be scoffed at.

Conjecture? maybe, but a plausible one nevertheless; it is a conjecture that follows a logical thought pattern, and is therefore informative and believable.

Wouldn't it be fascinating to conduct a similar survey on a much larger scale, collate the data, and publish the results.

Maybe you should mention this to your oncologist, see what they say?

Again, thanks for your help to us here on the forum, and valuable information regarding the big D!

pigeon

 

There was a recent Harvard medical research effort called the VITAL study: https://www.vitalstudy.org/

Results were 'inconclusive', but pointed to vitamin D having no impact on cancer rates, etc. Black participants, however, did see a significant 23% decline.

I found the study poorly designed in that amount of vitamin D used in the study and the level maintained in the blood was far lower (2000 IU's instead of 5-10,000 and 30-50 ng/ml instead of 60-80 ng/ml) than suggested by other work. Cancer suppression (or prevention) based on other much smaller studies showed the need for much more vitamin D in the blood. So the Vital study to me is flawed. They should follow up with a higher dose test (imagine that , "me" suggesting higher dose!@).

In the case of cardiovascular events - where they show vitamin D having no impact - no wonder. They are looking at vitamin D by itself. The body works sort of like a circuit with many parts giving a result. Cardiovascular requires vitamin K2 and D (and probably other things we don't even know about) to be heart healthy. Vitamin D works at the beginning and the end of the calcium system. K2 is the conveyor belt. Hard to examine one without the other. The Vital study did not look at K2 (which has implications for osteoporosis by the way).

 

Actually my vitD level was 50 when I was diagnosed in 2013. I maintain my level at 70-80 now.